Interview with Tim Fischer, National Party MP

Discussion about Tim Fischer's paper
on an Australian republic

National Seven Network, 8.50 AM 29th July, 2001

CHRIS BATH, PRESENTER:
Retiring National Party politician Tim Fischer's written a discussion paper providing two options for achieving an Australian republic. Mr Fischer joins us now from Albury in his electorate of Farrar.

Good morning, Mr Fischer, and welcome to Sunday Sunrise. Thanks for joining us.

TIM FISCHER, NATIONAL PARTY MP:
Greetings Chris and Glen.

BATH:
Many commentators are saying you've been outed as a republican, when in fact the Seven Network revealed your views a day before the Republic Referendum. You said then that change was inevitable. Are you surprised by the attention you're now getting?

FISCHER:

I'm not surprised. I've just continued to move in a particular direction after consulting with lawyers who pay taxes, consulting with my electors first and foremost. But this is a low priority issue. I have the Corowa Peoples Conference coming up later this year; and it's in that context I've launched a discussion paper.

BATH:
What's prompted you to come forward now with these options?

FISCHER:
The opening of the Oddfellows Hall, which is where the 1893 Federation Process was re?rolled. It was a magnificent opening yesterday by Treasurer Peter Costello, followed up by the Governor General, Dr Peter Hollingworth, visiting Corowa last night. It's putting Corowa on the map, and considering options in a substantial way, whether we can break the impasse on an issue, which is a low priority issue but one, which inevitably will be re?visited. I'm not a member of the ARM but I'm certainly looking at process as I've now got time to think and read.

GLEN MILNE, REPORTER:
Given the publicity that's surrounded your shift in the last two days, I've got a tough question for you, Tim Fischer: how did you vote in the 1999 referendum on the republic?

FISCHER:
That's a matter between me and my maker. But I...

MILNE:
I thought you might say that.

FISCHER:

I did vote at Boree Creek, and happily later today I'll head off on a family picnic barbecue and vanish up somewhere near the magnificent Mount Stanley, and by about sunset tomorrow, notwithstanding the substance of this issue, things will move on as I look at other good electorate projects. But, I think...

MILNE:
I guess what I'm asking is, a year ago', were you a republican or you were still a monarchist at that stage?

FISCHER:
Look, I was consulting with my own National Party. They clearly have a commitment to the existing constitution, but there is a drum beat, surprisingly strong around places like Corowa, which right along the border have a lot of frustrations right now with state governments. The feds have put forty?four million dollars on the table. The new bridges across the Murray, and...

MILNE:
Well, you've said that repeatedly, Tim Fischer, that you've taken soundings amongst your own constituents, if' you like. If that's the case and the constituency's moving, does that mean that you and Peter Costello are in step with the constituents, the voters, and perhaps John Howard's increasingly out of step?

FISCHER:
No, this issue will soon be bypassed by thirty?three days of intense campaign activity debating things like the exciting new super seniors' card, and the like.

MILNE:

But you do say, though, that voters are increasingly in favour of a republic. Is that not right?

FISCHER:
Well, as Ron Boswell correctly says, it's not an issue of support for a referendum this year or next, but Sir Zelman Cowen, Richard McGarvie, and Jack Hammond, QC, along with Corowa Shire Council, has convened a meeting in my electorate for later this year. Hence a degree of activity from me on this matter.

MILNE:
You could understand, couldn't you, (John Anderson, the current leader of the National Party, being a bit upset about this. I mean, how would have you felt if you'd have been leader of the National Party and the immediate past leader had come out and repudiated existing policy?

FISCHER:
As John Anderson and Mark Vaile correctly said yesterday particularly, look, first and foremost you look after your electorate, you are relevant to your electorate and to activities in your electorate. And Councillor Gary Poidevan, Councillor Bill Bott ? the National Party candidate for Farrer ? are all Corowa Shire councillors who have endorsed the Corowa People's Conference. So I am relating very much to my electorate...

MILNE:
But M...

FISCHER: ... and the campaign.

MILNE:
But Mr Fischer, Ron Boswell, a senior National Party Senator; De?Anne Kelly, a member up there around Mackay ... she's called on you to apologise. Ron Boswell says...

FISCHER:
(Laughs)

MILNE: ... that you shouldn't have raised the issue. De?Anne Kelly says you're suffering from attention deficit disorder.

FISCHER:
Well, I think what she meant was relevancy deprivation syndrome...

MILNE:
(Laughs)

FISCHER:
... the Gareth Evans matter. And I have never suffered from that. I've had yet another job offer last week from the magnificent Earth Sanctuaries. I've had about forty?nine since Deloitte's first approached and look, I've got plenty to do. But I'll put Corowa first and foremost...

MILNE:
But you won't apologising ... you won't be apologising?

FISCHER: I won't be. But I will be concentrating on good electorate work as I head out towards Wentworth later this week with Councillor Bill Bott.

BATH:
Mr Costello's a Republican, Mr Fischer. If he becomes our next Prime Minister, do you expect him to deliver a republic?

FISCHER:
Look, right now it's too early other than to look at process. And the process matter should be looked at separate from any three day federal election campaign period. And hopefully that will be the case. And then we'll see what happens. But it must be driven by the people. That's Peter Costello's point. I think it's everybody's point and the people chose in 1999 not to accept a republic and I take note of', that. And I've taken note of that in a discussion paper which is not arguing a particular end outcome but is arguing a process. Surely in this country we can have a mature debate about process in a substantial way.

BATH:
Just on that process, the green and gold options that you offer up in your discussion paper are pretty complicated. Do you expect Australians to do the hard yards to understand how they will work?

FISCHER:
Well, this is about asking the people do they want a formal referendum on the republic? And then asking them do they want a choice between methods of its selection of a president. That's not unreasonable in 2001. A choice between a Prime Minister selecting a largely ceremonial president, an expanded electoral college involving federal state parliaments and elected mayors, about fifteen hundred. Or a direct election by the people. It's giving the people the choice ... a people's choice pathway.


MILNE:
Tim Fischer, why not follow Kim Beazley's suggestion and that is hold a threshold plebiscite on whether Australians want a republic and then referendums on ... a referendum on the particular options? Isn't that a much simpler way of going about it?

FISCHER:
The problem with plebiscites is you can go right through a machinery of plebiscites at some expense unless held at the same day as another election. But at the end of that, you then put a proposal?specific ... a proposed law change to the Constitution to the people and they could in fact say no. I think it's better to cut to the chase but only after a lot of consultation, a lot of what has flown under the bridge. It's not going to happen tomorrow.

But a careful consideration of the process starting with the Corowa People's Conference where they're short of 'a bridge thanks to state government's sabotage but where the feds are going to pay twelve million dollars for a bridge. I digress, I know, Glenn. To come back to your point, it's where the Corowa People's Conference will address process and perhaps throw some new light on a pathway forward.

MILNE:
Don't your green and gold options, though, Mr Fischer, play into the direct electionists' hands in the sense that while ever there are any other models on the table apart from a direct election, they will unite with the monarchists and the republic will go down?

FISHER:
I don't think any one side should get a quantum leap up in changing the Constitution. Neither the status quoites ... I mean there are many clauses in this Constitution which are now totally irrelevant because it relate to the early transition but the status quoites should not get a leap up and nor ... neither should the Republicans.

I'm looking at process. The green option, particularly the gold option all help in fact put a pathway down which I think will be fairer, reasonable and that's the objective to provide a fair and reasonable alternative.

MILNE:
Do you acknowledge my point however that the direct electionists are absolutely determined to get that option up and when you put other options on the table they immediately will back the monarchists again?

FISHER:
No they won't if they've got a multiple choice at the same time or as part of the process and that's what we're about with the green and gold options to be considered carefully at Corowa.

MILNE:
One of the chief proponents of the direct election model is, of course, your former cabinet colleague Peter Reith. Would you be appealing to him now to widen the debate and consider the options you've put on the table?

FISHER:
Well I'll send him a copy. I've sent my colleagues a copy but I'll be about sunset tomorrow well immersed in other good electorate projects as I mentioned but I hope Peter Reith might turn up at the Corowa People's Conference.

BATH:

Mr Fisher, you said earlier that you've had a bit of time to do some thinking. What do you think is the future for Australia if we don't become a Republic?

FISHER:
It's about symbols. There's nothing wrong the fundamentals of our Constitution. We should remain within the Westminster system. I'm not offering the French presidential, the US presidential model. This is a great country celebrating a hundred years, in a very successful way, a lot more events to come and nevertheless there', are changes afoot.

The Queen should ... and her heirs and successors should absolutely remain the head of the Commonwealth. I'll argue for that but at the other level surely we should have an Aussie made product, absolute and a Aussie made process, absolute with no Buckingham Palace involved in the choosing of our governor general or if you choose the other name the president under a Westminster Republic.

BATH:
Mr Fisher, we'll leave it there. Have a terrific picnic at the foot of Mount Stanley today.

FISHER:
Thank you very much. Take care Chris, Glenn.

BATH:
Tim Fisher joining us there.

Transcript supplied by Rehame, Custom News and Analysis